Ok, gentleman, today we’re going to discuss hybristophilia, a term I think most encapsulates the female penchant for the “bad boy”. First the definition of the term according to a medical dictionary online,
A paraphilia in which a person is sexuoerotically attracted to a person who has committed an outrage or a gruesome crime
Maybe it’s better to start with some examples found in popular culture and work our way up to the real world examples. Many site the dynamic duo of the DC comics universe, the Joker and his equally psychopathic female companion Harley Quinn of being a clear cut example of the “Florence nightingale effect” In reference to the dedication that Florence Nightingale, who many consider to be the founder of modern nursing, demonstrated to her patients. It is described as follows:
The Florence Nightingale effect is a situation where a caregiver develops romantic and/or sexual feelings for his/her patient, even if very little communication or contact takes place outside of basic care. Feelings may fade once the patient is no longer in need of care, either by recovery or death.
I believe this is a misdiagnosis of Quinn, or at least only a partial diagnoses. If you’re versed on the Origins of the Jokers main squeeze, you’ll know that Quinn started as an Arkham asylum psychiatrist named Dr. Harleen Frances Quinzel, M.D, who was tasked during her internship with psychoanalysis of some of Gothams worse and most psychopathic criminals, one of which was the Joker himself. During the process of interviewing the Joker, Quinn became mesmerized by his Charisma, a trait that psychopaths often cultivate to hide their true natures. Swayed by the Jokers force of personality and charm, Quinn fell deeply in love with the Joker, culminating in her helping him escape, unleashing one of the most dangerous psychopaths in the DC comics universe back into the streets in the process, and eventually quit her comfortable life as a psychiatrist and joined him in his crime spree, taking on the persona of Harley Quinn as we know her today. Watch it all unfold here.
Harley Quinn suffered not only from this “Florence nightingale effect”, but instead from an advanced case of hybristophilia. Furthermore I will speculate here that hybristophilia is an as of yet poorly understood condition that seems to be categorized into a very simplistic classification of women who are hybrostophiliacs and women that are not hybrostiphiliacs with nothing residing in between.
Think back to our ancient existence, When human beings were leading prehistoric, short and often times violent lives. The creature comforts of our modern technologically advanced civilization simply didn’t exist. Mr. Caveman who wanted to have reproductive access to the female sex had to have something to offer in return. He had to assure the females he wanted to mate with that he would provide them with regular access to shelter and sustenance, He had to be violent enough to kill enough game so as to feed himself, his women and the children he produced with them, he also had to have an innate capacity to kill other men that may want to move in on the resource rich tract of land he controlled, or the women he had sexual access to. To put it bluntly, violent men have been selected by women for reproduction since time immemorial and despite the fact that we have, through a manipulation of evolutionary drives, built a civilization that alleviates this burden of violence to a large degree, a great many women still crave violent men.
Your average woman of course has no desire to date a violent psychopath, at least not one on the order of a serial killer like Ted Bundy or Richard Ramirez. But she does want a little bit of that violent cave man to trickle through the civilized exterior of the men she is attracted to on occasion. I’ve explored this topic somewhat in a video I uploaded a few years ago titled -Female Rape Fantasy Is Not What It Seems- and will post it here.
Essentially, Women seek to ensure their safety and provision within society via a sort of double-whammy attack pattern. Simply extracting male provision via tax payer subsidy is not enough. The obsession with protection and provision that we see from the female expresses itself on the macro scale, via the pursuance of sometimes downright fascistic laws surrounding violence against women such as rape shield and primary aggressor laws etc.
These laws are often times wholly inconsiderate of concepts of equality like due process and the hard won luxury of a legal system that presumes innocence before guilt is established. To the collective unconscious, the borg hive-mind that drives the enfranchised female masses, due process is irrelevant, they are voting with their hind brain and thus they vote to ensure that their most primitive needs and desires are addressed and satiated. The problem is they can never be satiated, they beckon and demand more safety and more provision…forever.
Thus, while female enfranchisement leverages the electoral process in their favor, and after the legal system has implemented as much gynocentrism as it can bear without collapsing, the individual female also has been simultaneously cultivating her individual instinct for her own protection and provision In the form of what we in the MGTOW world have coined as the “Alpha male brute”. An individual who is prone to violence and physically imposing enough to deal a lot of damage with it, who is also often times not intelligent enough to understand that he is an a servile position to the female he is involved with, existing as a hired thug who is paid in sexual access. It is an pincer attack designed to maximize benefit for the female collective, and frankly men’s rights, health, or lives never factor into this process in any meaningful way. It is purely and potently gynocentric.
Take as an example the following video, preceded by a quick synopsis.
-Woman walks into a fast food joint and cuts in line.
-Man responds by telling a person he is having a conversation with that the woman cut in line
-Woman overhears this and immediately gets in his face, bing rude, argumentative and ultimately violent
-Eventually her 300 lb ex convict boyfriend joins the conversation, at which point a brief confrontation between the man and her boyfriend ensues.
-Out of nowhere, the ex con boyfriend sucker punches the man, beating him viciously. Watch for yourself.
So then…what did we witness here besides a vicious attack? Well, lets start from the perspective of the woman. Let us assume hypothetically that this woman might have started this confrontation without her boyfriend there to protect her. Let’s assume that the men attacked her in self defense after she initiated the violence. This woman would likely have no problem relying on the first line of gynocentric protection available to her, that is the macro scale level protection of a police force or a passing white knight who would leap to her defense without even questioning who initiated the violence. This is why women advocate for primary aggressor laws that almost universally assume guilt on the part of the man in domestic violence disputes despite evidence to the contrary if it exists. Again, women want this to be the case, they are not concerned with due process and equal rights for men, they are concerned with leveraging the state and having it bolster their primordial reproductive habits.
In this case however, her boyfriend was around, who was by all accounts the alpha male brute that we describe in the mgtow community. He is prone to violence, physically imposing and almost seems to take pleasure in subjecting another man to the brutality he can unleash on behalf of his female master. It’s an extreme example of what all woman desire on some level, communal protections from non-violent men in the form of a legal system, and individual protections from violent men in the form these alpha male brutes that are more than willing to disregard those legal protections.
This is what drives the female tendency to hybristophilia, which only seems to be pathologised in the most extreme examples, but which actually lies instead on a continuum. It is a spectrum of hybristophilia ranging from the woman who prefers a spanking by her man in the bedroom, all the way up to and including the “serial killer groupies” that gained notoriety for swooning at hyper violent serial killers such as Ted Bundy and Richard Ramirez during the fanfare of their trials.
Every woman who asks you to choke her, spank her, smack her ass or spit on her in a safe and controlled setting during consensual sex is acting out this misunderstood urge. She is looking to you to unleash your inner cave man, she is asking you to become a violent weapon that she can wield for her protection, and in doing this she receives immense sexual stimulation.
I do not hate women for this, nor do I expect them to change this. I believe it is an innate quality of female sexual attraction. I do not excuse them either if they act on these urges in any way that causes real, instead of simulated violence against other human beings like the woman depicted above. The women that are so beholden to their primitive drives that they take to wielding one of these brutes via proxy violence to harm others should be locked up and kept away from civilized people.
But in terms of the urge, the female attraction to violent men, I suspect there is very little we can do to counteract this. The fictional universe of Gattaca addressed this via filtering out the genetic markers for violence they had discovered, and I suspect that the only way we will ever change this quirk of female attraction would be through something along those lines. This would necessitate a highly unethical eugenics campaign the likes of which I soundly reject and would never take part in. Given this, it seems we are left with containment of the beast as it were.
We will have to understand the female proclivity toward selecting violent men, and we will have to manage it and discourage it to the best of our ability. And so I begin our efforts here with simple documentation.
First we start with Anders Behring Breivik, the “cultural marxist” conspiracy theorist who slaughtered 77 souls, most of which were young adolescents. An article titled Norway’s mass murderer Anders Behring Breivik gets hundreds of love letters a year States the following:
STOCKHOLM (AFP) – She calls him by his first name, sends him letters every week, and promises to wait for him. It could be any love story but Victoria’s heart belongs to a mass murderer: Anders Behring Breivik.
Responsible for Norway’s worst peacetime killing since World War II, Breivik, like many other notorious killers, has his share of admirers, a phenomenon that can be accompanied by sexual attraction and in which case even has a term: hybristophilia.
“I really wouldn’t want to live a life without him,” says “Victoria”, who does not want her real name published.
A young Swedish woman in her 20s, she comes off as distant and standoffish, ignoring her fresh cup of coffee in a Stockholm hotel lobby. But her voice cracks when she talks about her “dearest Anders”.
From a small town in Sweden, she is doing everything she can to obtain an easing of Breivik’s prison conditions: he has spent the past four years in isolation at a high-security penitentiary.
He is currently serving a 21-year sentence, which can be extended if he is still considered a danger to society.
Breivik killed 77 people on July 22, 2011, when he set off a bomb near the government offices in Oslo and then opened fire on a Labour youth summer camp on the island of Utoya.
For Victoria, Breivik’s isolation amounts to “torture”.
“I care even more about him now that he is in such a vulnerable situation,” she says.
Unemployed because of health issues, she writes to him to help boost his morale – so far more than 150 letters – or sends him small gifts, including a dark blue tie he occasionally wore during his trial.
In return, she has received two letters from him – which she showed to AFP – the others having been blocked by prison officials tasked with censoring his mail.
– Marriage proposals –
It’s not easy to define her relationship with Breivik, a man she has never met since all of her requests to visit him have been denied.
She describes him as both her “old friend” and a protective “brother figure”, but admits that she finds him attractive and “there were romantic interests, at first, at least from my part.”
She says their first contact dates back to 2007 when they met through an online game. He cut off ties with her two years later, most likely to concentrate on planning his attacks.
But in early 2012, Victoria reconnected with the man who by then had become the most hated person in Norway.
And she is not alone.
The weekly Morgenbladet reported last year that Breivik receives “at least” 800 letters a year, many of them from female admirers. During his 2012 trial, it emerged that a 16-year-old girl had asked him to marry her.
Hybristophilia is a term used by criminologists – but not scientists – to describe a sexual attraction to violent killers in prison, who often receive racy love letters or sexy undergarments from their fans.
Also known as the “Bonnie and Clyde syndrome”, it has existed throughout time and across borders.
Josef Fritzl of Austria, who held his daughter captive and raped her repeatedly for 25 years, and American killer Charles Manson also have their own fan clubs.
– Often abused women –
According to Sheila Isenberg, an American author who interviewed 30 women for her book Women Who Love Men Who Kill, these admirers often have a history of sexual abuse.
“It’s a chance for a woman to be in control (the man is behind bars for life and has no control over anything), when previously she had been abused by her father (or) other men,” she explained to AFP.
“Also, it is romance with a capital R: exciting, thrilling, (a) never-ending rollercoaster. Nothing humdrum or ordinary about these relationships.”
There is, however, no scientific evidence to support the widespread belief that these women feel they are on a mission to help the killer get on the right track in life, said Amanda Vicary, an assistant professor of psychology at Wesleyan University in the United States.
“Some women tend to be drawn to famous men – it’s possible that the reason for some women’s attraction to men who have done horrible things is not so much what they’ve done, but the fame they have received from their acts,” she said.
Victoria, meanwhile, says she is not a fame seeker.
Her involvement with Breivik has already cost her her relationship with her sister, who, upon learning of her ties to him, told her: “You’re dead to me.”
And she has distanced herself from her friends.
She admits to “more or less” sharing Breivik’s Islamophobic ideology, but says she is opposed to violence.
So how can she love a man who coldly gunned down dozens of terrified teenagers, some of whom begged him to spare their lives?
“I guess I had to separate Anders from Breivik really. I think of Anders as my old friend and Breivik as the person who did all those things.”
The years go by, and yet, she refuses to give up on him.
“I miss him more and more every day. I guess my feelings have gotten a bit stronger.”
Another interesting article that I stumbled on will really give you a bit of insight into the nature of this phenomenon, it is titled Editorial: On Love, Sex and Murderers and is very long so I will post only the parts I deem relevant:
Serial killers are interesting.
We are at once fascinated and repulsed by the study of sociopaths out for blood – and most often, men out for the blood of women. The idea of the “good” serial killer à la Dexter is a relatively new one, but it’s a long known fact that women flooded Ted Bundy with love letters, a woman married Richard Ramirez while he was in jail, and there are countless other examples of lesser known criminals and their groupies.
ted-bundy-collage Why? We ask why serial killers do what they do all the time – perhaps this is where the fascination starts for people who identify as “hybristophiliacs.”
A few years ago I encountered a girl who was around sixteen that self-identified as a Ted-Head (a Ted Bundy groupie). It was easy to dismiss as the romanticization of a man who’s horror she had never experienced. Her other interests were, like many of mine, dark and subversive.
My thinking at the time was that some day she would grow up and realize that finding a person interesting is not the same as finding them emotionally or sexually attractive. After all, Bundy used the fact that he was a handsome man to kill women. He’s not exactly the kind of guy you would want to date (you wouldn’t want to date Rodney James Alcala, either, but he famously won The Dating Game).
I wanted to write a bit about the Ted Bundy phenomenon and how it continues in a new generation. I started at a website titled Bundyphile, hoping to start right at the source in my efforts to write about and gain some understanding of the young women embracing Bundy (one Facebook page referred to him as “The misunderstood voice of a generation”). The themes featured on these sites were repetitive:
Bundy wasn’t “all bad”. Bundy was misunderstood. Yes, what Bundy did was wrong, but you can love and admire him without idolizing his crimes.
Many of the women and girls obsessing over Bundy and other serial killers seem to think they could be the person to change them, or nurture them, or be “the one” that was there for them and kept all the bad things from happening. In one blog entry, a woman calling herself “Lolita” proclaims, in all caps of course, “ANYWAY, IF MY OWN DEATH COULD FILL THE HOLLOW SOUL OF TED BUNDY, I [WOULD] HAVE REALLY LOVED TO BE HIS LAST VICTIM.”
She claimed they were similar, she claimed to understand him. He was “different” from other killers (remember, Ted Bundy was likely dead before this woman was born). A few minutes into my research it became clear that one cannot look for Ted-Heads without finding Dahmer “fangirls” and the obsession many internet fangirls have with gay male sex. Specifically, Ted Bundy and Jeffrey Dahmer engaged in gay sex.
This was around the time my research took a sharp left turn. Up to this point, the women seemed emotionally invested, and yes, obsessed. They seemed to believe that the love of a woman like themselves could have saved the violent men they idolized.
When I hit Mrs. Dahmer’s Infinityland, it became clear that there was much more to this phenomenon than the tendency of high school/college aged girls to fall for “misunderstood,” “dark” men. This was about sex. Okay, yeah. I guess we knew that, but it was about some seriously dark, disturbing sex based completely on how violent and terrible these men were. A tumblr post reads:
-Most girls: Have you seen his body, though?
-Me: Have you seen his body count though?
“Mrs. Dahmer’s” page features several photos of Dahmer, most mug shots or photos of him in prison jumpsuits. The photos are captioned lovingly, the way you might imagine a middle school girl might caption a photo of her favorite Disney heart-throb in her diary, but it devolves from there rather quickly.
Once I discover the “hybristerotica” tag on tumblr, things get decidedly dark, decidedly fast.
A tumblr dedicated to the celebration of hybristophilia drags me deep into a corner of the internet I never expected to find. Sex and Crime All The Time features, among other things, photos of famous serial killers with sexually explicit “confessions” plastered over them and a serial erotica story called Stockholm Syndrome focusing on Richard Ramirez.
night-stalker I want to take a moment to state that I understand that rape fantasy is not the same as wanting to be raped and that plenty of women with healthy sex lives are into rough play – however, I think this fantasy becomes a little different when the fantasies are focused on men known to prey on women violently.
I also wonder about the line in the sand as these women proudly identify as “hybristophiliacs” and defend the legitimacy of this attraction, though the profile of women who fit the definition isn’t a list of positive personality traits and many of them admit to sexual dysfunction outside of situations where they are fantasizing about killers.
The hardcore hybristophiliacs don’t often bother with claiming the men they obsess over are “misunderstood,” or “only part bad.” When an anonymous fan of the tumblr asks if Ted Bundy loved his wife and child, the owner of the blog answers, “I don’t think he did.”
There do seem to be limits, though. One anon says she’s “sad” because Eric Harris’s diary featured homophobic sentiment. The owner of the blog comforts her by assuming he would have outgrown those sentiments if he had lived. The “line,” however doesn’t have anything to do with the way the men treated women.
It seems the worse the offense, the more these women are drawn to them, the more violent the fantasy.
For some reason, I find the obsession with men like Bundy and Ramirez less disturbing than the sexual and romantic fantasies associated with more recent killers. There is a good chance the women idolizing Bundy, wearing his face on pendants, and staring at his picture weren’t alive when Bundy died in 1989. He can be a “character” like Loki from the Avengers or yes, even Dexter. No one they know has had contact with him, they didn’t feel the fear and horror he caused personally.
But the women fantasizing about Elliot Rodger were most definitely alive when he opened fire in Santa Barbara in May of this year. Their obsession goes deeper than his looks – these women have studied his hateful videos and so-called manifesto. His vitriol toward women does nothing to push these hybristophiliacs away. In fact, it seems to do the opposite, all the women drawn to Rodger have a common desire – to be his first girlfriend.
To be the girl that calms the anger in him. Some fantasize about Rodger with Dylan Kleibold and Eric Harris of the Columbine shooting, positing that they could show him how to get women. Hybristerotica features two erotic “fan-fiction” pieces on Eliot Rodger, one written from his point of view, and another told from a woman’s point of view – In Come Over and Fuck Me, she imagines herself as his lifelong friend, unaware of his lust for her.
The erotica isn’t well-written, but that’s not the point. It doesn’t have to be. The very thought of fucking these dangerous men is what entraps the women participating on the hybristophilia tags on tumblr. The serial killer fandom and hybristophiliacs receive a lot of negative attention from other tumblr users, particularly those who enjoy true-crime but do not want to associate with people they feel fetishize and idolize murderers.
If you go through any of the popular hybristophilia tags you will see defenses of hybristophilia again and again. They insist they are not mocking the victims or supporting the crime, they respect the victims – they just also find themselves attracted to the murderer. The most interesting case is the group of young women obsessed with high-school shooter TJ Lane.
While his fans insist they respect the victims and the families of the victims they also praise him for wearing shirts that say ‘KILLER’ on them in court and pass around GIFs of him saying, to the parents of his victims, “The hand that pulled the trigger to kill your sons now masturbates to the memory. Fuck all of you,” while flipping them off.
They brand this as “sass” and tag photos of him with “the king of sass.” Almost all the memes, GIFs, and collages of TJ Lane involve that quote in whole or in part. They love him, in large part, because he was disrespectful to the families of his victims.
It seems the worse the offense, the more these women are drawn to them, the more violent the fantasy.
Some hybristophiliacs claim that they are completely normal, one even citing her therapist in defense of her obsession with TJ Lane. Others claim it is no different from any other paraphilia (a condition in which a person’s sexual arousal and gratification depend on fantasizing about and engaging in sexual behavior that is atypical and extreme) and as such should be respected.
It is worth noting that pedophilia is the most common type of paraphilia and no one is suggesting we support pedophiles as normal – not even the hybristophiliacs that are into men who have abused children. The four most common types of paraphilia involve a dismissal of consent – pedophilia, exhibitionism, voyeurism, and frotteurism – the act of rubbing oneself on non-consenting persons.
Another fact worth considering in “respecting” hybristophiliacs as “normal” is that paraphilia often leads to sexual dysfunction – needing the thing they are attracted to for sexual gratification. If hybristophilia makes women who love serial killers unable to have healthy sex lives with men who don’t want to rape or kill them, I would dare say it isn’t normal. These observations aren’t meant as judgment on the hybristophilia communities, per se, but to be fair to them also means showing the side that doesn’t support their claims of normalcy.
So why do women want sociopaths? Why is a half decent face and a high body count a draw for them? Even Timothy McVeigh had entries under hybristophilia tags – there seems to be no limit. Some are purely sexual, some are borderline romantic, and some are downright disturbing given the men they are discussing. Here are a couple from the Jahar (Dzhokhar) Tsarnaev tag.
The deeper I got into the hybristophilia tags and websites the less sense it seemed to make. Going into this, I admit, I figured I would find a few groups of misfits that were still into Ted Bundy and Richard Ramirez. Like many, I read the articles that came out showing that the Tsarnaevs, James Holmes, and Adam Lanza had attracted a female following – but most of the quoted content seemed to be “Oh he’s hot,” which can be an objective opinion—although most people have a harder time separating a person’s attractiveness from their actions.
The longing, claims of love, unending support and hero-worship definitely shook me. When I hit the graphic sex, I felt like I was spinning out. My brain can’t really make sense of it, especially in cases like that of TJ Lane, who is not only remorseless, but took such glee in rubbing his crimes in the faces of the families of those he killed.
I have always viewed Halloween, horror movies and books, and a fascination of the dark and disturbing a healthy reaction to a terrifying world. People study serial killers because we know that though they behave like monsters, they are human. By learning about them we gain knowledge and that helps us feel proactive and therefore, safe.
When we get into horror and the supernatural, it’s a terror we can control.
It’s a skull made of papier mache you can hold in your hand and know it’s not so bad. What’s disturbing about the hybristophiliacs on the internet, what is so unsettling, is that they’ve crossed the line somehow. They’ve gone beyond a desire to understand, beyond a fascination, and right into an uncontrolled obsession.
Phew, Okay gentleman, thats about all of the documentation i can handle for the moment. We will attack this more in depth later.
Feel free to check out these articles that cover similar topics.
For a Video Vlog of Hybristophilia, The female attraction to violence watch below.